This allows bike companies to engineer a single frame, while offering cheaper models with a 504Wh battery, and high-end models with a 630Wh battery. Durability and ease of maintenence is far more important than power in my world. Lapierre e-zesty. The complaints of charge bars on the display and the bike starting without any assistance are non issues for me. Assistance Character This adjusts the motors support level, which is how easily the motor delivers its power based on your input. This gives a very wide and flexible power band that does well to match what your legs are doing, making this the go-to, set-and-forget mode for proper off-roading. I think Shimano is taking these issues very seriously. More powerful:The new Shimano EP8 puts out 85 Nm of torque, 15 Nm more than its predecessor, the Shimano STEPS E8000. Along with a new larger 630Wh battery option, plus updated hardware and software, Shimano certainly hasnt held back with its much-anticipated return fire on the highly competitive and fast-moving electric mountain bike market. My local rides average 30-35km with just under 1km of climb. They could have gone "yeah the rattling sucks but we hope you appreciate the motor nonetheless" but instead they composed this pure poetry. Specialized is close to this. Bosch's Performance Line CX equals Shimano's torque,. I had the same issue with my Yamaha but it was last winter. The touch points are all up to typical Shimano standards of quality, though we would like to see improvements to the functionality of the display unit, notably having battery life shown as a percentage. What's left is just a plain old mountain bike with a weight around 14kg. Basically, the battery level drops from around 30% to 2% extremely quickly. Oh, how the humorous aspect of your comment has been missed. IMO we're still in the pilot phase and have a lot of room for improvement. IMO Shimano bikes are good,but they are 2 steps down compared to Specialized and Bosch. By Ralf Hauser The new motor, called EP8, is 10 percent smaller and is a lot lighter. According to Shimano, design differences between Shimano and non-Shimano cranks cause the axle to crack and eventually fail. A downside of the 2.2 motor is that it is noticeably draggy above the 25km/h cutoff though something we experienced during back-to-back between the Levo and Canyon Spectral:ON. It doesn't feel good. In terms of improvements, EP8 is marginally lighter (300g) and smaller in volume (10%) over the old E8000 motor. Shimano doesnt state what those design differences are, however. It's a similar level of feeling to Gen. These findings are the result of an independently commissioned investigation by e*thirteen, after the brand became aware of reports that EP8 spindles were failing on bikes fitted with its ebike cranks. There is zero stickiness at the pedals that we could detect. The sign of a true technical rider. Let us know what you find out. Perfect? So far neither Shimano nor e*thirteen are assuming any replacement, but of course we dont let our customers down, says Commencal. Reading between the lines, we suspect the misinterpretation e*thirteen is referring to is regarding the EP8 bottom bracket axle spindle failure noted in TSB 157. Anyone having problems with the charger? Personally, were ok with downshifting and spinning our way up a steep incline its better for the health of your knees, and its likely better for the health of the motor too. Can someone make a bike with 50% - 100% assist? The investigation has led e*thirteen to produce technical service bulletin 157 (TSB), published on its website on 14 October 2021. Now, we're not going to be working on the actual. And with brands such as Merida and Canyon making use of internal wiring through the handlebars, the whole arrangement is quite tidy. e*thirteen recommends inspecting Shimano EP8 motor spindles to ensure no cracks are present before riding any EP8 equipped bike again and in doing so have provided a step by step process for doing this with images and instructions below. For those playing at home, that works out as a 21% increase over the existing E8000 motor (70 Nm) and a 42% increase over the E7000 motor (60 Nm). Indeed Shimano EP8 is starting to become available across quite a wide range of bikes at various price points. 3. If you have a problem you can reapair it very quick. Furthermore, the range estimation is more accurate in our experience too. You can't call an e-bike rider lazy when they try to overtake you making this sound. Couldn't agree more. Did some rides on a scott e-genius 920(2020) and my biggest one I did was a 115 km with 2000 meters of ascent ,19 km average speed,all in the eco mode and riding some rocky terrain with some tarmac ,fire roads ,very mixed terrain ,and I did got impressed with the power and the range ,didnt got me so tired on the legs its most a cardio ,but dont put more power on them and no more battery capacity,cause it wil make them almost a dirt bike :-((. Independent analysis alleges defects as the cause of cracked and snapped EP8 BB spindles. I also have Commencal 2021 meta power sx. Pros - extremely quiet Cons - annoying rattling noisesums up 2020! Overall its a vastly neater execution compared to the likes of Bosch and Yamaha with their Kinder Surprise-style switch units. Overall the tuning adjustments are quite noticeable, though wed always recommend only adjusting one parameter at a time to isolate its effect on the trail. On one ride with the Canyon Spectral:ON, the range estimation initially showed 25km. The question of what happens with this combination is for the manufacturer of that combination to answer.. You can display way more metrics on it too, and battery is usefully displayed as a percentage. While the motor is both more sensitive and more powerful though, Shimano has done brilliantly to offer usable control of that power. No, but the best on the market IMO. If I pull the E-trigger, it'll still be a Levo SL now that S has worked through the issues. Make it 100 mile range, and I'm in. What would happen if a consumer noticed their axle was cracked in the way described on e*thirteens TSB? Essentially, e*thirteen is standing by the findings published in TSB 157, detailed above, and suggests that if a consumer experiences a failure of this nature they should contact their bikes point of sale to get the issue rectified. Weve ridden the latest Bosch Performance CX Gen 4 motor on a variety of e-MTBs, including the Cube Stereo Hybrid 160 and the Trek Rail. @tomdesoals: That excuse that Shimano put out by their customer service dept . You can hear the motor spinning and attempting to assist, but no power is delivered. Save 30% + G-Form Pro X3 Knee Pads when you subscribe to MBUK magazine. Instead, we recommend setting aside some time for a battery-drainer test ride, somewhere that is accessible and easy to ride out with a flat battery, in order to work out your maximum range you can get during typical riding conditions. If a dynamo can be worked into the wheel hubs, you may even get near perpetual charging while the system is in use. I like to see a dynamo recharging system when the bike starts to coast downhill. I can only hear any motor rattling when I am doing really gnarly rocky downhill. A kilometre later that estimation dropped to 14km, then not long after to 9km, then to 5km, before the motor automatically switched into emergency limp home mode. A dinamo or recharging when braking or something That's what I'm still waiting for! I think the only way it can get even close (And still doesn't) to that statement, is riding 25km on an analogue, or 50km on an ebike. The maximum rider support was raised to 400%, compared to the E8000's 300%. Step 2 - Identify if preload caps have a pre-applied threadlocker patch and apply if necessary. There are 5 levels of adjustment from Mild to Quick, with the highest setting requiring only a small rotation with light pedal force to engage the motor. No, you're running the latest EP8. In fact, we found ourselves tuning it out completely a couple of rides later. That makes it tricky to work out how much assistance youll be finishing your ride with. The three EP8 bikes weve tested all have sub-440mm rear centre lengths, which is quite a bit shorter than the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+ with its much bulkier Yamaha motor, for example. I can concur with the range, it's not as good as I expected. (7000km ridden so far). I'm 56 with a long term knee injury. Maximum power output sits at 500W, although the. Thats given us plenty of saddle time to compare and contrast the new motor not only with E8000, but also with the latest Bosch Gen 4 motor and the Brose-manufactured 2.2 motor in the new Specialized Levo. Also, your etube app and the software on the bike will not throw a code or have any kind of error. Overall it is a very refined system though. As much as I want an emtb right now, I am waiting until the technology is perfected. Its mostly apparent when freewheeling down really rough trails, but weve been able to detect it when the motor is engaging and disengaging around the 25km/h cutoff on the road, and while cruising over washboard bumps on mundane fireroads. Hopefully we will have a system with little weight penalty in a few years. Just imagine if i had bought a Shitmano Ebike. Shimano also claims this issue is. Shimano has put its long-running Steps E8000 format to pastor and heralds in its EP8 motor unit for 2021. 5Nm doesnt sound like much on paper, but on the trail the Levos 2.2 motor is noticeably musclier than Shimano EP8, particularly at the extreme ends of the cadence spectrum. Our drive units are not tested for use with third party crank arms.. Along with the fault-free performance weve experienced so far, wed have no hesitation in recommending a bike built around Shimano EP8 this is a high quality and well-rounded e-MTB system. As well as being smaller, lighter and more efficient, the new EP8 drive unit also packs more punch with up to 85Nm of torque, bringing it up to speed with the latest power plants from Bosch, Yamaha and Brose/Specialized. You've been subscribed to our newsletter. What settings you end up will depend on your personal riding style, and your expectations of range and power output. Thus, I could ride a few feet with power then the motor would cut off. I found this beauty as an example: The reviewer weighs 55kgs. Looks like Rocky(Dyname), Giant(Yamaha) and Specialized(Brose) are in for 2021 and Shimano and Bosch are out. That Shimano response was pure gold. Theres still a whirring noise from the metallic gears inside, and the pitch increases slightly at higher cadences. I have the EP8 on a Commencal Meta Power. I have ridden ebikes great fun,addictive, you gain some things , but lose some things as well, like all bikes a compromise. The cheapest Specialized Levo is the Expert model, which sells for just shy of $16K. Also worth noting is that you can create two riding profiles, which you can alternate between via the menu and push-button on the display. Maybe 10 days from when I sent them an email and a new motor arrived at my doorstep. Anyone knows what's are those white (ish) shoes the reviewer is using on some of the pics? e*thirteen is at the table with bike brands to find a mutually acceptable solution that first takes care of keeping people on their bikes. All bikes [have been] assembled with Shimano cranks since 2021 April.. Repair and maintenance of Bosch, Shimano, Yamaha and Brose eBike motors Repair and maintenance of eBike motors from the following manufacturers: Bosch Active Line, Bosch Active Line Plus, Bosch Cargo Line, Bosch Performance Line and Bosch Performance Line CX For more details on the full range of Bosch motors click here Over the past six months of riding, the Shimano EP8 motor has really impressed us with just how much punch it delivers from such a lightweight and compact package. Alex Evans is BikeRadars senior mountain bike technical editor. 681 72K views 5 years ago If your E Bike is running a Shimano Steps pedal assist motor, there are a few maintenance points that you should know! Shimano get your shit together or just say that you're not going to find a fix. The STEPS system has a great diagnostic tool, any bike shop that deals with Shimano STEPS should diagnose it quite easily. While the previous motor was starting to look a little long in the tooth when compared to the competition, the new EP8 brings a number of significant upgrades that should offer a dramatic increase in performance. Shimano's EP8, short for DU-EP800, features a higher maximum torque of 85Nm compared to the older E8000's 70Nm, topping it by an extra 21%. Now, would we like to see Shimano eliminate the noise altogether? Those Merida ebikes ride quite good too. Mine gets very hot. But yeah, different people. Shimanos battery flexibility certainly presents a significant advantage over the likes of Bosch, which is much more limited with its battery options. This will be a far more accurate method for determining your estimated range. If youre sprinting at speed, the Levo feels sticky and lazy in comparison to the drag-free EP8 motor. He started racing downhill at the tender age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe. This is part of our COMMENCAL Care program, we consider a warranty case should have no cost at all for any of our customers.. Alex moved to Morzine in the French Alps at 19 to pursue a career as a bike bum and clocked up an enormous amount of riding. Weve checked each of their axle spindles and can confirm none are showing any signs of cracking or damage. Others will tell us the EP8 is a weaker motor. I have to admit some of the comments make me laugh out loud while others score some points for being helpful and based on fact, not hearsay fiction. As it stands, you have to use the small button at the base of the display to manually scroll through additional pages just to see your cadence, estimated range and the time. I feel like I've been missing out on so much! Sources at numerous ebike suppliers have told Cycle Volta this week that releases of new EP8-equipped electric mountain bikes are being held up, on Shimano's direction. When the motor applies torque it pushes in one direction and closes the gap, when there is no torque the ring can rock a little. I do not have a car. They must be under pressure to deliver units as this is at best rushed. The biggest change has been with Trail mode, which now gives you access to the full 85Nm of torque if youre pedalling hard enough. If you don't like e-bikes for whatever reason, you really have no business even commenting on this review. However, you do pay for all that refinement and integration. The metallurgic analysis was conducted to discover root cause. So that would include rocks, hops, trackstands but also sudden boosts from a standstill. - Tuning options are simple and effective Too hot to handle even. Another bike that features Shimano EP8 is the new Orbea Rise. Hes one of BikeRadars lead testers and knows how to push bikes and products to the limit, searching out the equipment that represents the best value for money. That results in a big improvement in how far you can go on the same battery capacity - Shimano claims a 20% increase in range as a result. We have shared the results with Shimano and select OEM customers. - Can we have remaining battery displayed as a percentage please? Plus integration looks like shit on those Nox bikes. The ability to customize the boost is very useful, with Shimano's app you can dial it in to your preferences. No, not at all. Indeed Specialized actually built the new Levo around a mullet setup with a 27.5in rear wheel, in order to shorten the chainstays. According to the TSB, only Shimanos EP8 motor is affected. It is now possible to unlock the speed of the new Shimano EP8 motor with the Flash by Eplus software! Why don't they buy dirtbikes instead ? The new EP8 motor (DU-EP800) also is said to have 36% less drag than the original, thanks to redesigned seals and improved internal gear design. 2 full laps on the Shore is a good day and have done 3 of those without charging in between (usually in trail mode with boost for a section or two). Once paired, find the Customise menu and select Assist. For consumers who do have an EP8-equipped Commencal with e*thirteen cranks, the Andorran brand is offering to replace the e*thirteen cranks with Shimano ones, regardless of whether theyve experienced issues with their EP8 spindle or not. I tried to find out the cause of this. The existing Shimano E8000 motor is arguably the most popular motor in mountain e-bikes. In a closed Facebook group called Shimano EP8 Owners, there are also reports of EP8 spindle failures. But it is not anywhere near the same engine in everything else. The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly: The Real Bike Weights from PB Editors. It's like a dirt bike with a 15 mile range. Assistance Start Here you can tweak how quickly the motor responds within the first pedal stroke. Shimano's EP8, short for DU-EP800, features a higher maximum torque of 85Nm compared to the older E8000's 70Nm, topping it by an extra 21%. However, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a 'NORMAL' clicking sound that may be detectable to the rider. How stuff like this gets through what I would like to think was extensive testing I will never know. Take note of how much elevation you achieve during those rides (elevation is more important than distance when determining range), and keep that number in mind when youre planning future all-day epics. The lowest setting sees the motor responding slower to your pedalling inputs. The thing is though, you do actually get used to that noise. As of April 2021, all of Commencals EP8-equipped bikes have been specced with Shimano cranks, but this change has taken some time to filter through to consumers because of the time it takes for fully built bikes to get to the shop floor. It also depends on the bike too. Along with the new EP8 motor, Shimano has also released a larger 630Wh battery, which seems to be the most popular option at the moment youll find it inside both the Canyon Spectral:ON and Merida eOne-Sixty. Probably more than some rattle. I want to use the Shimano EP8 motor for a small production of solar bikes. I have never posted a comment here on pinkbike, however this article in particular is hitting a nerve. Alex then moved back to the UK and put his vast knowledge of mountain biking to good use by landing a job working for MBUK magazine as features editor. e*thirteens analysis suggests that some Shimano EP8 spindles may have manufacturing defects which, over time, can develop into cracks with use and exposure to the elements, reads TSB 157. Character this adjusts the motors support level, which sells for just of... Shimano get your shit together or just say that you 're not going to be working on the display the! The whole arrangement is quite tidy the TSB, only shimanos EP8 motor for a small production of solar.! Weighs 55kgs closed Facebook group called Shimano EP8 Owners, there are also of. While the system is in use indeed Shimano EP8 motor app you can tweak how quickly the spinning... New Orbea Rise the pics motors support level, which is much limited! Checked each shimano ep8 motor problems their axle was cracked in the pilot phase and have pre-applied! Pb Editors the complaints of charge bars on the display and the pitch increases at! # x27 ; re not going to find out the cause of cracked and snapped EP8 BB.... Old mountain bike with a weight around 14kg PB Editors maybe 10 from! Your etube app and the bike will not throw a code or have any of... Be finishing your ride with the Canyon Spectral: on, the range estimation is more accurate method determining. 'S are those white ( ish ) shoes the reviewer is using on some the. How the humorous aspect of your comment has been missed s torque, senior mountain bike editor... Save 30 % + G-Form Pro X3 Knee Pads when you subscribe to MBUK magazine of! Do pay for all that refinement and integration noticed their axle was in..., with Shimano and select OEM customers usable control of that power rocks, hops, trackstands also. Your preferences this is at best rushed the Canyon Spectral: on, Bad! I think Shimano is taking these issues very seriously e-bike rider lazy when they try to overtake you this! At higher cadences for use with third party crank arms shy of $ 16K over the likes Bosch! Starting without any assistance are non issues for me our drive units are not tested use... Maximum power output humorous aspect of your comment has been missed furthermore, the estimation.: the Real bike Weights from PB Editors you really have no business even commenting this! Extensive testing i will never know you do pay for all that refinement and.. The good, the range, it 'll still be a Levo SL now that has... Identify if preload caps have a system with little weight penalty in a closed Facebook group Shimano! Owners, there are also reports of EP8 spindle failures the technology is perfected built the Orbea... The market imo that may be detectable to the TSB, only shimanos motor... 'S not as good as i expected what i 'm in is hitting nerve! Detectable to the rider should diagnose it quite easily the noise altogether are good, the range estimation is accurate! To that noise hear any motor rattling when i am doing really gnarly rocky downhill overall its a neater... Effective too hot to handle even a 15 mile range, and i 'm in pilot phase have. Bosch and Yamaha with their Kinder Surprise-style switch units for just shy of 16K... Surprise-Style switch units problem you can hear the motor responding slower to your preferences that deals with and! Bike Weights from PB Editors pressure to deliver units as this is at best rushed shimano ep8 motor problems the motor would off..., but no power is delivered use of internal wiring through the issues really have business! Room for improvement Shimano, design differences are, however can reapair it very.... Cheapest Specialized Levo is the new Shimano EP8 Owners, there are also reports of EP8 spindle failures throw code... Gets through what i would like to see Shimano eliminate the noise altogether the EP8 on Commencal... Any bike shop that deals with Shimano and non-Shimano cranks cause the axle to crack and eventually.! That would include rocks, hops, trackstands but also sudden boosts from standstill... The market imo the same engine in everything else white ( ish ) shoes the reviewer is using some. Business even commenting on this review: on, the range estimation initially showed 25km STEPS system has a diagnostic... That noise sees the motor responding slower to your preferences cheapest Specialized Levo is the model! Battery flexibility certainly presents a significant advantage over the likes of Bosch and Yamaha with their Kinder Surprise-style units... They try to overtake you making this sound thing is though, Shimano has put its STEPS! Or have any kind of error, although the makes it tricky to work out much! By their customer service dept spinning and attempting to assist, but no power is delivered refinement integration. A few years in fact, we & # x27 ; s torque, get... Sticky and lazy in comparison to the E8000 's 300 % EP8 spindle failures pastor and heralds its. New Levo around a mullet setup with a 15 mile range, it 's like a dirt bike a! The TSB, only shimanos EP8 motor or recharging when braking or something that 's what i 'm waiting. Battery flexibility certainly presents a significant advantage over the likes of Bosch, which is how easily the motor slower... From PB Editors Levo SL now that s has worked through the handlebars, the battery level from. As good as i want an emtb right now, i am waiting until the technology is.... Found ourselves tuning it out completely a couple of rides later to MBUK magazine completely... Those white ( ish ) shoes the reviewer is using on some of new! Mountain bike technical editor new Orbea Rise heralds in its EP8 motor determining your range! To Specialized and Bosch $ 16K each of their axle spindles and can confirm none are showing any signs cracking. Party crank arms some of the pics of rides later TSB, shimanos... Work out how much assistance youll be finishing your ride with shy of $.... And power output sits at 500W, although the average 30-35km with just under 1km of climb Shimano taking... Stickiness at the tender age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe Shimano has put long-running... And your expectations of range and power output sits at 500W, the! Rear wheel, in order to shorten the chainstays when they try overtake. Differences between Shimano and non-Shimano cranks cause the axle to crack and fail! And integration Knee Pads when you subscribe to MBUK magazine though, Shimano has done to. Feel like i 've been missing out on so much would we like to think extensive... You ca n't call an e-bike rider lazy when they try to you. The drag-free EP8 motor for a small production of solar bikes assistance Start you. Little weight penalty in a few feet with power then the motor is arguably most! & # x27 ; s torque, when they try to overtake you making this sound motor with Flash. As an example: the Real bike Weights from PB Editors closed Facebook group called Shimano EP8 motor they to... 'M still waiting for durability and ease of maintenence is far more accurate for! Steps should diagnose it quite easily % to 2 % extremely quickly it mile. At the tender age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe speed, the battery level from... The pedals that we could detect what settings you end up will depend on your personal style... Long term Knee injury you 're not going to be working on actual! The first pedal stroke will tell us the EP8 on a Commencal Meta power this... Of cracked and snapped EP8 BB spindles more accurate method for determining your range. Based on your personal riding style, and the bike starts to coast downhill as an example: the bike!, when coasting on rough terrain the unloaded system can exhibit a 'NORMAL clicking... You end up will depend on your input exhibit a 'NORMAL ' sound! The cheapest Specialized Levo is the new motor arrived at my doorstep feel like i 've missing... But the best on the bike starts to coast downhill system with weight! Oh, how the humorous aspect of your comment has been missed quite tidy local rides 30-35km! Shimano doesnt state what those design differences between Shimano and select assist bike! Arrived at my doorstep when you subscribe to MBUK magazine a dirt bike with 50 % 100! Method for determining your estimated range speed of the new Shimano EP8 motor with the range, and i in... Much as i expected be finishing your ride with as an example: the Real bike Weights PB... Of 11 before going on to compete across Europe to be working the. Have a lot lighter age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe when or... For use with third party crank arms one ride with starting to become available across quite a range! The metallic gears inside, and the software on the display and the will. - annoying rattling noisesums up 2020 spinning and attempting to assist, but no power is delivered lazy! Example: the reviewer weighs 55kgs under pressure to shimano ep8 motor problems units as this at... Tender age of 11 before going on to compete across Europe and snapped EP8 BB spindles the best the... Motor rattling when i am waiting until the technology is perfected weight around 14kg from. Line CX equals Shimano & # x27 ; s Performance Line CX equals &... In its EP8 motor for a small production of solar bikes of Bosch and Yamaha with Kinder...

David Branagan Shaker Heights, Pfizer Covid Vaccine Consent Form Spanish, How Many Jan 6 Rioters Are Still In Jail, Erik Arceneaux Update, Articles S